Weapon Rebalance mod v3.17, All things having to do with equipment! Options

[Xentax]

I've (somewhat relucantly) noticed lately that Gyrostablisers *might* still be overpowered.

My troops (with Rifle skill between Good and Heroic, granted) that carry HK33's with Gyro's and recoil compensators almost always have 99 or 100% accuracy, if they're in range at all. Moreover, the accuracy seems to even last through the full 3-shot burst.

I ran about 6-10 tactical missions last night. On *several* Cultist missions, I'd fire 30-75 shots with a cumulative accuracy of 97-100% (after the 3rd mission in a row with 100% accuracy, I knew something was up).

Now, don't get me wrong - I certainly like my troops kicking butt and taking names. But, being *that* accurate is pushing my suspension of disbelief just a tad. I'm perfectly OK with the laser weapons being like this (they are 'frickin laser beams'), since the damage is scaled accordingly; but assault rifle damage with that accuracy was...something else.

On a related note, it did produce rather comical physics effects - one cultist was hit with multiple critical shots almost simultaneously (and about six 'normal' hits as well), and was sent flying so hard he actually stuck to the "ceiling" of the map (a good 20+ feet above ground). I have the screenshots if anyone wants a laugh.

[ShadoWarrior]

I've (somewhat relucantly) noticed lately that Gyrostablisers *might* still be overpowered.

My troops (with Rifle skill between Good and Heroic, granted) that carry HK33's with Gyro's and recoil compensators almost always have 99 or 100% accuracy, if they're in range at all. Moreover, the accuracy seems to even last through the full 3-shot burst.

Please do a forum SEARCH on "accuracy", find this thread: 100% Accuracy Modding Bug, and read it.

FYI, the gyro is accuracy 115%, and the (modded) recoil compensator is 105% (unmodded is 85%).

[Gorre]

I don't know if this was intentional or not, but the Durally Bayonet is still using the model of the UB Laser sight.

Just thought I'd let you know.

[ShadoWarrior]

I don't know if this was intentional or not, but the Durally Bayonet is still using the model of the UB Laser sight.

Thanks. An oversight which has been fixed for v3.17.

[Gorre]

YW. I just want to ask someting. Would you be willing to increase the rate of fire for the Laser Machinegun? Currently it is much slower than the drone version, and I even use the Minimi more than the LasMG.

EDIT: I would also like to ask if you would be willing to add the different versions of the XM8, like you mentioned on page 102 of this thread. the 20'' barrel sharpshooter, etc. And to keep them from looking the same, perhaps rman (or psychophat) could lengthen/shorten the barrels of them for appropriate measure.

[ShadoWarrior]

1. No. It is balanced as it is.

2. No. The 20" version wouldn't be that much different. There are better things that I and the gfx artists can be doing with our time.

[Xentax]

I've (somewhat relucantly) noticed lately that Gyrostablisers *might* still be overpowered.

My troops (with Rifle skill between Good and Heroic, granted) that carry HK33's with Gyro's and recoil compensators almost always have 99 or 100% accuracy, if they're in range at all. Moreover, the accuracy seems to even last through the full 3-shot burst.

Please do a forum SEARCH on "accuracy", find this thread: 100% Accuracy Modding Bug, and read it.

FYI, the gyro is accuracy 115%, and the (modded) recoil compensator is 105% (unmodded is 85%).

Looks like the actual thread of interest is this one (especially the 2nd page). I'm not sure why you insist on making people search the forum when a quick link saves so much trouble.

So, if I'm understanding this correctly, even using the recoil compensator with any of (gyro/laser sight/sniper scope/motion finder/aimpoint finder/flechette ammo) constitutes an exploit, due to the unfixed bug? That sucks.

Does the thermal sight (the scope add-on, not the helmet add-on or implant) affect accuracy as above? Also, you said the recoil compensator affects accuracy, but does it also do anything to recoil/refire rate as the original description implies (I was using it on machine guns for that reason)?

I'll change my weapon loadouts to avoid this.

Finally, I'm betting this has been asked before, but is there a specific reason you don't include the "actual" accessory effects in the glossary entries in-game? I keep reading effects that don't quite match those described, and I've seen various indications that the listed effects on the weapons aren't reliable (for one example, check the range on a UB shotgun mounted on a laser rifle), and the modded weapons don't show updated stats anyway. It'd be nice to flip the glossary in-game and make an intelligent choice for things like gyro vs. UBLS vs. aimpoint finder, and of course that would influence manufacturing as well.

Again, I ask thinking there IS a reason (and I just haven't searched for it long enough ). I can see you not wanting to have to fix it every time you balance an item, for example, though I haven't seen much "churn" to items once you add them.

[ShadoWarrior]

I'm not sure why you insist on making people search the forum when a quick link saves so much trouble.

Simple: why should I do people's searches for them? My time is at least as valuable as theirs. Sorry if that's blunt, but sometimes people need to be hit over the head to see the obvious (and to shake them out of their bad habits, to learn to do things for themselves instead of expecting others to do things for them).

[Xentax]

While I know where this sentiment comes from, and can sympathize, there's still times where it's a nudge in the right direction, and other times where it's just being difficult. If no-one ever shared their prior experience and insight, we'd all feel pretty lonely, wouldn't we?

Given how big the impact of the accuracy bug is to the game, even with the improvements and additions to your mod, I would think the relevant discussion thread URL at least deserves a spot in the mod FAQ. Then, instead of gently nudging people to search the forum (admit it, the forum search/results are lame compared to what most of us have come to expect from web search), you can say "RTFFAQ"

-X

[ShadoWarrior]

The FAQ has been updated for v3.17. Thanks for the suggestion.

BTW, in spite of RTFFAQ, people don't. I'm not holding my breath. The universe has an unlimited capacity for stupidity and laziness.

PS - the thermal scope just changes the imaging mode. It doesn't add bonuses. That question's been asked before, but I'm feeling particularly nice at this moment and will save you the effort of using the forum's search.

PPS - you're right, a very few folks have asked before why the exact effects of weapon accessories are not in the Glossary. It's something that I've overlooked and has been added to v3.17.

[Ant_Man]

What about something that is a one shot wonder. Basically something like a small grenade launcher which can only be fitter under the barrel of a rifle. The weapon would have medium to long range with poor accuracy. It would fire a single shot that can only be realoaded between missions (this would mean that the rifle its attached to could not also have a grenade launcher attached).

It would fire lots of small explosive rounds that would carpet a relatively large area. About half would explode but the other half would not. The ones that do not would then detonate when another ordinance went off near them or when a character treads on or near them. The actual individual damage it would do would be minimum, however it would knock the character over and potentially stun them depending on that characters toughness.

It would be a double edged weapon in the fact that you wouldn't be able to control which rounds go off or even where they go. And you would not be able to see them if they don't.

I would envisage this being used either when the enemy is grouped or as a mine laying device to try and act as an early warning device or to slow the enemy's advance down.

Cheers,

Ant

[Xentax]

The FAQ has been updated for v3.17. Thanks for the suggestion.

BTW, in spite of RTFFAQ, people don't. I'm not holding my breath. The universe has an unlimited capacity for stupidity and laziness.

PS - the thermal scope just changes the imaging mode. It doesn't add bonuses. That question's been asked before, but I'm feeling particularly nice at this moment and will save you the effort of using the forum's search.

PPS - you're right, a very few folks have asked before why the exact effects of weapon accessories are not in the Glossary. It's something that I've overlooked and has been added to v3.17.

I agree on the universe's capacity - but "RTFFAQ" is a lot shorter than "use the forum's search feature to find the answer to your question" Plus, as I said, the forum's search sucks, while an FAQ is quick and easy (and if it's not, it's time to go back to Minesweeper.exe).

Thanks for the thermal scope info - I read the in-game description again after I asked which made me almost sure it DID affect accuracy - good to know. I was afraid there was nothing BUT accuracy mods for the visor mount, which limits flexibility somewhat (as in, for most weapons, if you want to use all 3 slots, you have accel or silencer/suppressor for muzzle, secondary weapon for UB, and accuracy mod for the visor). Granted, it's hard to imagine what ELSE you'd put on the scope aside from things that improve vision/accuracy.

If you can use any help (even just proofreading) on the Glossary changes, just holler.

[khamul]

ShadoWarrior - you were asking for feedback and suggestions on the various tweaked opponents in the game so time ago. I have suggestions, if you're still interested.

I've been fighting the SG for soooo long now. They're tedious. The only SG unit that's actually dangerous is the Hover, and those go down quickly to a laser MG. The trouble is the Defenders. They can't do anything to you, but they take so long to go down. It's just dull.

Theoretically, a unit that gets in the way of your lines of fire, and is hard to kill, is a good idea. It forces you to adapt your tactics. But not if
( A ) It doesn't have sufficient AI to block your lines of fire, and
( B ) You can't win until you kill it anyway.
Then it's just a waste of your time.

Can we change the Defender to a straightforward attack unit?

It would add some punch to the SG, which otherwise have precious little, and make them, if not an enemy to be feared, at least one to be respected.
I recommend a relatively low-damage rapid-fire short range laser, something like the laser MG. They need to use a short-range weapon, in keeping with their habit of trying to get close. They also need their resistances tweaked - I'd recommend reducing their Psi resistance, and making them vulnerable (40-50% resist) to maybe Plasma and Sonic. That way you still need to keep a diverse team, and it gives your close-combat specialists something to do.

[Xentax]

The description for the HUD helmet add-on says it improves ability to detect and aim at enemies. Does that mean it affects accuracy and (therefore) has a buggy effect when combined with other accuracy modifiers? Or is that just a more elaborate way of saying it improves detection range?

-X
(I did search the forum first - kinda tough to do a meaningful search for HUD though; I tried "hud helmet", "hud AND helmet", etc.)

[ShadoWarrior]

Affects accuracy.